Comments on: Readers’ Forum: Screwed by a headhunter

By: Dave Padilla

Dave Padilla — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 15:06:46 +0000

Headhunter cost me a job with his Bravado. Two companies: one smaller, hip, Google-like; the other large, rock solid and a little stodgy.
Both interviews the same week. Both companies 10 NYC blocks away from each other.

Both want me to work for them – the rub is the Headhunter pushes for more money Because “they like you so much”. They decline and go with a guy asking less, costing me solid/stodgy job. I take the back up: the pre-IPO, hipster gig.

9 Weeks later the crash hits and my new company is gone in 10 days.

“If you think you are underpaid now, wait until no-one is paying you at all”

By: Don Harkness

Don Harkness — Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:31:28 +0000

I see you objectively didn’t mention it, but in general for now and the rest of her career she should invest time in learning how the recruting industry works, starting with your book “How to work With Recruiters”
Good advise to see if HR will explain what happened. Obviously there are a # of scenarios. She can at least leave that company with a clearer understanding about her clean hands.
In the future she can/should
research the recruiter’s firm
research the recruiter (google, facebook etc)
ask him/her for references: satisfied candidates/clients. recruiters are in sales and they should be able to come up with referrals like any other sales person. And I’ve heard the excuse about that being proprietary info etc. baloney, you get permission from the referral like any other reference account
you’ll either feel good or antsy about the results and if the latter check with HR, though that won’t win points with the recruiter. Also F100 companies usually have approved vendors lists. that offers an opportunity to network with a friendly face in the company to just check the list to see if that recruiter’s company in on the list and/or with HR to find out if they do business with outside agencies.

By: Karsten

Karsten — Thu, 21 Jan 2010 09:54:17 +0000

Well, I wrote my first experience with a HH in the comment of this post: http://corcodilos.com/blog/1288/puppy-dog-headhunters

So far, I have sent a resume, but no reply. Therefore, I have asked for a confirmation of reception. If I am not satisfied, I think I will have to prohibit them from doing anything with my resume, and demand confirmation. Now, I realize that a HH does not need to contact med unless they consider me for a position, but acknowledging the reception would just be normal politeness…?

By: Alan Geller

Alan Geller — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 23:22:04 +0000

Jake,

I appreciate what your saying but I currently have an offer on the table from a global division head of a public company. Their M.O. as is the M.O. of some other firms that I”ve made placements with is not to bother themselves with recruiter contracts until either they’re sold on the recruiting firms ability to deliver quality candidates OR the offer stage is reached. Yes, the possibility always exists that without a retainer the search firm could get screwed, but as I mentioned earlier it’s no different than selling enterprise software to a pragmatist buyer and then working with legal as the last step in the process.

I do agree that HR can kill placements for the rank and file and at times I’ve seen HR trump a CEO’s wish to see a candidate; but once you’re dealing with CEO’s and division heads HR usually suports their desires.

By: Nick Corcodilos

Nick Corcodilos — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 23:09:10 +0000

RE: Erika’s post and language.

I very rarely pull a post. Don’t even remember the last time I had to do it. The quality of discourse on every Ask The Headhunter forum I’ve ever run has been incredibly high. (One of my boards had over 50,000 posts on it when I was on The Motley Fool. Probably pulled about 5 posts in all that time.)

This forum is not a place for naked political expressions, but I see no problem with brief political jokes or expressions made in passing without rancor. Public figures arouse emotion. They get poked at because politics affects business. I’ve got a pretty broad sense of humor and I’m pretty tolerant. That said, I’m sorry if anyone was offended, but I see nothing offensive in anything anyone has said on this thread.

(PS – I don’t know how my post came up as “Jake” on post dated January 20, 2010 at 6:55 pm. I’ll try to fix it.)

By: Nick Corcodilos

Nick Corcodilos — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 22:55:49 +0000

@Alan Geller: Long ago I did some placements without first having a written contract with the client company. As you point out, integrity is key. But I’ve also encountered companies – always BIG ones – where a manager wants to see a candidate, but later in the process HR rejects the submission because there is no contract.

Recently a contractor gave me a price to do some work on my home. He would not give me the written job spec to review overnight – just wanted me to sign and give him a payment. He was afraid I’d use the spec to shop the job around. I walked away. No contract, no job. I’d never do an assignment today without a written agreement. Not because I don’t trust someone, but because it’s poor business practice.

Like good fences make good neighbors, good contracts make for happy business partners. Work out the nitty gritty in advance so no one has to yell at anyone later. The point of a good contract is to ensure everyone is safe and happy.

With big companies, the contract is not controlled by the hiring manager but by HR. Good luck. If an HR manager decides to play rough, you’re screwed. Yes, word gets around. But you’re still screwed.

[***This post originally went up under the name "Jake" -- I'm not sure how that happened. I have corrected it and put my name on it.]

By: Andreas

Andreas — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 22:25:49 +0000

I see nothing wrong with Erika’s post.

By: Alan Geller

Alan Geller — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 22:05:26 +0000

“And it’s the job hunter’s obligation to herself to make sure the intermediary she has chosen to work through is authorized to do the deal. That’s why good contracts have a statement just above the signature section that says something like this: “The signator certifies that he or she is authorized to commit the company to this agreement.” This doesn’t really ensure you’ll get paid – but it does give you recourse against the signator if he or she lied and signed the paper.”

Nick: In principle this sounds good. In reality the three largest placements that I’ve made over the past three years had no pre-existing contract in place. The firms that hired my candidates agreed to see them based on the value being brought to the table with the understanding that if they pulled the trigger a contract would be generated. It’s no different than making a software sale to a pragmatist buyer. The legal/contract stuff often is the last thing to be finalized not the first. That said the terms of the agreement were discussed and verbally accepted by the client companies however there were no signed agreements in place until furher down the road.

By: Alfie

Alfie — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 19:31:17 +0000

I support Bob’s support of Erika, who supported parakeeta. Truth does matter.

By: Bob

Bob — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 19:13:57 +0000

I support Erika’s thread.